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Discussion Starter #1
Has anyone seen this or this?

They basically say that VW is targeting the speed6 with an upcoming passat, even saying they are building a "Mazdaspeed6 killer".

I have a hard time seeing a passat compete with mazda's pricing.
 

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Nice VW, however, you're right. No way is that thing going to come in under $45,000 U.S. in loaded form. Heck, a new GTi costs more than an MS6. It will probably be heavier than the MS6 by a couple hundred pounds. The power projections don't look too far off of the MS6 and I doubt that it will make as much torque. The car doesn't look better IMO. Also the MS6 will net better MPG overall. If they're aiming directly at the MS6 I think that's bad marketing. That's more of an Acura TL Type-S fighter right there.
 

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Koko hit it spot on....There is no way this car will even compete with the MS6, Especially a Modded MS6...

Not to mention the Reliability of a VW that everyone fears.
 

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also the new pedestrian safety reg's made some of the new european designs a joke. This passat is one of them. The huge front overhang, combined with the bubbly front (to protect the pedestrians in case of a collision) makes the front look out of proportion. Pretty ridiculous in my opinion... wouldn't touch that design with a 10' pole....
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I think It's nice that vw is wanting to get in on the market but it seems like an upgraded Jetta gli would be a better target for the speed6 than the passat. I still find it weird that the speed6 was brought up as a target. I just never thought that many people knew about it. I'd think most people reading the article would say, "...uh what's a mazdaspeed6?"
 

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The design is interesting, but the front end seems too large and overdone. The MS6 has nice lines with a subtle front that still gives it that sporty feel without being too gawdy. Of course, this is just my opinion. And I can't help to agree with the price issue - the regular Passat books for a starting price of near $23K for a 2007, add a fully loaded package to that and you're paying about what most MS6 owners paid for their cars. The price of this so-called "Mazdaspeed 6 killer" will be a VW market killer. They're definitely aiming for the wrong target.

Again, just my sleep deprived opinion. =) :zzz:
 

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Nice VW, however, you're right. No way is that thing going to come in under $45,000 U.S. in loaded form. Heck, a new GTi costs more than an MS6. It will probably be heavier than the MS6 by a couple hundred pounds. The power projections don't look too far off of the MS6 and I doubt that it will make as much torque. The car doesn't look better IMO. Also the MS6 will net better MPG overall. If they're aiming directly at the MS6 I think that's bad marketing. That's more of an Acura TL Type-S fighter right there.
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Suprise they already have the All Motion Passat with a 3.6 here now for about $30K. Offering a sport model would hardly push this car into the $45K range. The automatic Passat with 3.6 gets 26 MPG - I would expect a manual to get a little better. The current 3.6 makes 256 ft/lbs of torque at 2750 RPM. A modified engine would probably make even more. 3.6 liters is a healthy amount of displacement. The fully equipped automatic Passat AWD weighs in at 3800 lbs. I would expect a sport edition to shed a couple lbs. This car will be very nice indeed. The Passat shares very similar dimensions to the MS6 so I do see it as a direct competitor. If it had been on the market when I was looking I would have considered an R36 Passat. But lets talk about styling! The Passat looks like a frik'n Pontiac.
 

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yah vw shouldn't go through with this. the 6 has the passat beat on looks among many other things. the speed6 looks fast but i dont think a passat can be made to look fast it's a luxury car in my opinion. and if you've got a speed6 and a passat in front of you, what would you pick?

j dragon you changed your avatar, nyce.
 

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Considering the R32 was priced in the STI-EVO range but significantly underperformed both cars (even with extensive modification) it's safe to say the R36 will be priced out of line with it's performance.

The AWD V6 passat is already priced up with the IS350, G35 and the A4 3.2.

But with VW's cult like marketing they may be able to stir up a good number of sales.
 

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so shoot me i kind of like it, but i dont think i could live with it everyday
for the same reason i couldnt live with an evo or a sti, it looks over the top
 

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what's with the huge opening in the lower grill of the bumpers on these new cars... it could fit like 15" potlights in there for fogs..
 

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Koko hit it spot on....There is no way this car will even compete with the MS6, Especially a Modded MS6...

Not to mention the Reliability of a VW that everyone fears.
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Thanks Dragon. :)

Suprise they already have the All Motion Passat with a 3.6 here now for about $30K. Offering a sport model would hardly push this car into the $45K range. The automatic Passat with 3.6 gets 26 MPG - I would expect a manual to get a little better. The current 3.6 makes 256 ft/lbs of torque at 2750 RPM. A modified engine would probably make even more. 3.6 liters is a healthy amount of displacement. The fully equipped automatic Passat AWD weighs in at 3800 lbs. I would expect a sport edition to shed a couple lbs. This car will be very nice indeed. The Passat shares very similar dimensions to the MS6 so I do see it as a direct competitor. If it had been on the market when I was looking I would have considered an R36 Passat. But lets talk about styling! The Passat looks like a frik'n Pontiac.
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I beg to differ. I know that there is a 4Motion Passat currently available. However, it doesn't compete with the MS6 as far as "sport" goes. The current Passat 4Motion well appointed MSRP's for $31,900. To get what the numbers and performance they're aiming for in the articles you're talking upgrades for the engine, (even if it's only an ECU remap), exhaust, suspension, asthetics, paint variations, rims, tires, structual rigidity enhancements, and miscellaneous appointments. With all that you're talking an additional premium of at least $8,000-$9,000. Especially if the production numbers will be limited like the R32/34's. The current GTi sells for around $26,000ish. There is no way this tuned Passat will come in under $40k. Combine that with the fanatical following surrounding VW's and you're at $42kish+ OTD, add the inevitable "Market Adjustment" and you can arrive at 45k easy. That's Farfuggnugen baby! LOL. Also, from a performance standpoint the car would have to make around 300lbs+ tq. Which is about what the MS6 puts out. It can be done, but it will cost. As for the weight issue, if the car already weights in at 3,800lbs I don't see it getting any lighter. If anything it may stay about the same weight or get heavier due to the necessary structural enhancements it would need. Shaving weight costs money, which will be added to the price of the car. It will be a very nice car, just not an MS6 priced competitor IMO. That will put it out of the range of many a buyer especially if they drive the MS6 and realize they can get the same or better performance for $8-$10k less. I think the reason they've specifically targeted the MS6 buyer is that the MS6/MPS sells very well overseas. Europeans especially appreciate a car like the MS6 moreso than the common American driver.
 

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watch out for the scirocco coming back out, i just saw pics of it last night. WOW. I hope it runs right though. My 2001 jetta 1.8t spent on average 3 days per month at the dealership, and i had it for 4 years. Yeah do the math, thats why i dumped my GTI and Jetta at the same time. I do miss the power they did have though
 

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why are those cars so damn heavy anyways.
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The metal is Adamantium. :D
 

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VW already tried one $40K passat (the 8-cylinder one) and that went over like a lead balloon. I'd imagine this one will do just about as well. Why anyone would spend 3-series money for a passat is beyond me. If you really want a VAG car that'll be close to the MS6 in performance get a 2.0L A4 and put a big turbo on it. Of course in order to do that you'll spend a lot more than a MS6 costs and you'll have that wonderful VW reliability to go with it (and a voided warranty because of all the work you did)
 
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