[DkoD]

the 235/45zr17 will fit on 17*7 oem wheel???

 

[FormulaLT1]

yes but noone here will suggest you do that and you'll have a hell of a time finding a shop to do it because the minimum recommended rim width for a 235/45 is 7.5". I'd only say it's ok if you were running a VERY stiff walled race tire.

 

[Tire Guy]

I'd only say it's ok if you were running a VERY stiff walled race tire.
[/b]

It would be even LESS okay in that instance. For racing tires, you want the widest wheel you can use for a particular size. You can mount a 235/45R17 on the stock 17 inch wheel, but it will be pinched down and performance will actually suffer as a result. This will also lead to premature failure of the tire due to cracking of the bead and/or shoulder area of the tire and uneven wear. This is why 235/45R17 is not recommended for the stock wheel. That's why so many people are using 225/45R17.

Recommended sizes for the 6

 

[FormulaLT1]

I've never seen a racer put anything but the widest tire they can fit on the rim. go to a local auto-x and look what crazy stuff people are putting on their 350Zs for example. Around here we have them putting 285s on 7.5" wheels. And no racer likes toyo's. they're not anywhere on any of the top 10 SCCA cars in any class.

 

[Tire Guy]

I've never seen a racer put anything but the widest tire they can fit on the rim. go to a local auto-x and look what crazy stuff people are putting on their 350Zs for example. Around here we have them putting 285s on 7.5" wheels. And no racer likes toyo's. they're not anywhere on any of the top 10 SCCA cars in any class.
[/b]

So, what's your point, 6 speed 6? Just because Joe Blow at the auto-x does it, it means they know what they're doing? And you don't see Toyo at your auto-x's because we don't make an autocross tire. Ours is a road racing tire designed for spec series. Go to a NASA event and you'll see lots of RA-1s. So don't hand me any b.s. that "no racer likes Toyo." :sarc: Please. Oh, and the Speed Channel Touring Car and GT series uses the RA-1 exclusively, which is an SCCA professional series. If you have something against Toyo, just say so.

And don't take my word for it about the wheel width thing, Tire Rack seems to be pretty respected and here's their thoughts on the subject:

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/tec...e.jsp?techid=64

"When developing your vehicle's handling, maximize your:

Wheels - Always use the widest wheel allowed on your car's class, that fits your car and/or is recommended by the tire manufacturer for your tire size."

 

[FormulaLT1]

well considering the joe blows compete on the national level I'd trust them to know. These same guys also race NASA events and these same guys think toyos are out classed by the other tires.
and as far as a series running toyo tires, they'd run any tire that was willing to support the events. They only all run the same tire because the rules say so. You know that if it were up to the teams, everyone would run the tires they want, not the tires they're forced to use.

I don't have a problem with toyo though. I think they're ok tires. But they're not the best and I think you're head has grown a little big. I work for the only shipyard that builds aircraft carriers in the US but it doesn't make me an expert on them. You can keep quoting web pages all you want but the fact is that most racers will run the widest tires they can fit on a rim.

 

[Tire Guy]

well considering the joe blows compete on the national level I'd trust them to know...You can keep quoting web pages all you want but the fact is that most racers will run the widest tires they can fit on a rim.
[/b]

Hey, who am I to argue with you and your autocross buddies? Obviously you all have discovered something that tire engineers have been unable to discover. I'm quoting other pages to back up my assertion. What do you have to back up your argument besides anecdotal stories about your autocross buddies?

These same guys also race NASA events and these same guys think toyos are out classed by the other tires.
and as far as a series running toyo tires, they'd run any tire that was willing to support the events. They only all run the same tire because the rules say so. You know that if it were up to the teams, everyone would run the tires they want, not the tires they're forced to use.

I don't have a problem with toyo though. I think they're ok tires. But they're not the best and I think you're head has grown a little big.
[/b]

Obviously, you do have a problem with either me or Toyo, because the original question was whether or not a 235/45R17 would work on the stock wheel and when I corrected your post about competition tires in that size on a 7 inch wheel, you come back with an insult about Toyo. What did that have to do with the original post?

And I never said the RA-1 was the fastest tire. There are several tires out there that can turn faster lap times. What people like about the RA-1 is that it is consistent throughout the race. Some tires have a "sweet spot" and then start to get greasy. RA-1 doesn't do that. And the RA-1 is durable. Many racers can get a whole season or more on a set of RA-1s. That means a lot to grassroots racers who don't have unlimited tire budgets. I can appreciate that your buddies don't think we make the fastest tire, but making a super gummy, unpredictable tire that is toast after two weekends isn't what we're about.

I work for the only shipyard that builds aircraft carriers in the US but it doesn't make me an expert on them. [/b]

Well, it should! It would certainly make you more of an expert than me. And considering my job is to know about tires and I have lots of experience testing and racing on them, and I've been in the tire industry over 17 years, it does make me an expert. Maybe that sounds cocky to you, but after all these years, I'd better be an expert, or I'd be out of a job. And I don't pretend to know it all, there's plenty of subjects I know nothing about and I'm not ashamed to admit it. But I know tires. :yesnod:

 

[zoomnbyu]

I wouldn't do it! The handling will be screwed up and the center tread wear will be heavy.

 

[DkoD]

thx a lot for answering my question i go with 225/45zr17 with 17" oem wheel

 

[alexoleary]

I've never seen a racer put anything but the widest tire they can fit on the rim. go to a local auto-x and look what crazy stuff people are putting on their 350Zs for example. Around here we have them putting 285s on 7.5" wheels. And no racer likes toyo's. they're not anywhere on any of the top 10 SCCA cars in any class.
[/b]

Ouch! Just damn...OUCH!

 

[posttosh]

Ouch! Just damn...OUCH!
[/b]

Yeah, but in this thread, toyoguy is right on. (And probably surprised to see me agreeing with him.)

 

[GaryS]

Since this thread has drifted way off topic-

So, what's your point, 6 speed 6? Just because Joe Blow at the auto-x does it, it means they know what they're doing? [/b]

Actually they do know what they are doing: getting the most rubber on the ground possible. Longevity is not what they are after.

And you don't see Toyo at your auto-x's because we don't make an autocross tire.[/b]

Actually the T1R (a good high performance street tire) is eligible for the Street Tire classes in SCCA autocross but to date no cars have trophied or even entered at the SCCA Solo II Nationals on Toyos.

Other than that, you are correct.

 

[Tire Guy]

Yeah, but in this thread, toyoguy is right on. (And probably surprised to see me agreeing with him.)
[/b]

*faints*

Actually they do know what they are doing: getting the most rubber on the ground possible. Longevity is not what they are after.[/b]

Hey, I'm all about getting the most amount of rubber you can on the ground. BUT, if you're not putting that wide tire on the proper width wheel to maximize sidewall performance, then you're wasting your money. It's a common misconception to put the widest rubber that will fit on a particular wheel. And here posttosh and I will agree: you must put the proper size tire for a particular wheel width to maximize the tire's performance.

Actually the T1R (a good high performance street tire) is eligible for the Street Tire classes in SCCA autocross but to date no cars have trophied or even entered at the SCCA Solo II Nationals on Toyos.

Other than that, you are correct. [/b]

Although the T1R may qualify for the Street Tire class, it was not designed with autocrossing in mind. When I say we don't make an autocross-specific tire, I'm referring to tires that other manufacturers make, like Hoosier A6, Yokohama A008RSII (no longer produced) and others that have/had compounds specific for the demands of autocross. Road racing tires have very different compounds and construction. Toyo's RA-1 is optimized for road racing and we don't make an autocross-specific tire. Other than that, you are correct.

 

[DennisW]

well considering the joe blows compete on the national level I'd trust them to know. These same guys also race NASA events and these same guys think toyos are out classed by the other tires.
and as far as a series running toyo tires, they'd run any tire that was willing to support the events. They only all run the same tire because the rules say so. You know that if it were up to the teams, everyone would run the tires they want, not the tires they're forced to use.

I don't have a problem with toyo though. I think they're ok tires. But they're not the best and I think you're head has grown a little big. I work for the only shipyard that builds aircraft carriers in the US but it doesn't make me an expert on them. You can keep quoting web pages all you want but the fact is that most racers will run the widest tires they can fit on a rim.
[/b]

One important thing Speed........a road racing tire usually makes a crappy autocross tire.

Why? because road racing tires take time to come up to operating temperature and THEN they get sticky. Cold race tires are like driving on ice. Ever see cars weaving back and forth on pace and caution laps? Three guesses why they're doing it. If you said heating up the tires you're correct.

In autocrossing you don't have time to heat up the tires, they have to be sticky from the time you leave the gate, hence the creation of the specific autocross tires by companies like Hoosier and Kumho. Just because Toyo doesn't make an autocross tire doesn't mean that they're trash FOR THEIR INTENDED APPLICATION.
Geez, get your facts straight before you crucify someone..! :nono:

And add another voice with a lot of years of road racing experience to the group who disagrees with your theory that its ok to put a wide tire on a narrow rim......thats just plain silly. :wacko:

But you'll believe what you want to believe I wager, so this discussion is probably pretty pointless. :tear: