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Discussion Starter #1
Hey guys, I recently purchased a 2004 Mazda 6, 2.3 auto. I bought it with a blown head gasket, so rather than repairing that engine I decided to swap the engine with a 2006 Ford Fusion engine. I used the write up on the happywrenching page as a guide. The car will crank but not start, I am not getting any spark. I have not checked to see if the injectors are pulsing but the plugs don't smell like gas so I am not sure that they are. I drove this car into my garage, and it ran well so I assume my sensors are good. I swapped over everything listed in the happywrenching write up (sensors, harness, intake cam, oil pan etc). Can you all help me figure this one out?
 

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check your fuses, you could have a blown fuse, it happens, also check if all of your wire harness sensors are in the right place. Also with swapping engines some parts need to be changed, it could be that while the swap was done the fuel pump went bad, which is common in most mazdas, when the car sits around for to long it goes bad. Also check the voltage on the alternator? that could be another reason. Your best bet is to get an OBD2 if you can and see if the ECU is sending codes. My ECU flashes when it has any codes. Also, recheck your timing, it could be that the timing is off. Theres so many things you can use as a check list to see what the fault is. If theres no gas, probably a fuel line is kinked, not plugged in, or not working. Could be that the sensors on the fuel rail aren't functioning. lol Sorry, but check a couple of those.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
check your fuses, you could have a blown fuse, it happens, also check if all of your wire harness sensors are in the right place. Also with swapping engines some parts need to be changed, it could be that while the swap was done the fuel pump went bad, which is common in most mazdas, when the car sits around for to long it goes bad. Also check the voltage on the alternator? that could be another reason. Your best bet is to get an OBD2 if you can and see if the ECU is sending codes. My ECU flashes when it has any codes. Also, recheck your timing, it could be that the timing is off. Theres so many things you can use as a check list to see what the fault is. If theres no gas, probably a fuel line is kinked, not plugged in, or not working. Could be that the sensors on the fuel rail aren't functioning. lol Sorry, but check a couple of those.


I'll check the fuses, but I did not put the battery in the car until everything was already plugged in. The fuel pump is buzzing so I assume it's fine. The battery is new so the voltage at the battery for starting should be fine. The ecu does not have any stored codes, but then again it will not start, so I don't think it has had a chance to throw a code. I plan to re check the timing if I cannot pin point anything else. The fuel lines are not kinked. I am not getting spark for sure so I need to figure out why then go from there.
 

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The electronics between those years are quite different. There is probably a dozen different sensors and such, but visually they look the same. Id bet you forgot one of those sensors, and thats your issue. Hell it could be as simple as even just using the newer crank pulley on the older ecu.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
The electronics between those years are quite different. There is probably a dozen different sensors and such, but visually they look the same. Id bet you forgot one of those sensors, and thats your issue. Hell it could be as simple as even just using the newer crank pulley on the older ecu.
Yeah, I thought I got all of them swapped over. Once I verify the coil is getting 12volts and grounded properly then I will start looking at the sensors again. I wish CEL would get triggered to help point me down a path.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I had a chance to troubleshoot a little bit. The coil does show 12v on the center pin when the key is in the on position when I ground the multi meter black lead to the battery -. But if I just hold my red lead on the center pin and probe the other two pins with the black lead I get nothing. So I am thinking I am having a grounding problem for the coil pack. I checked the two grounds on top of the transaxle that I see and they seem to be good. Since that car that is pictured (from the happywrenching write up) is a COP car and I have just one coil pack with spark plug wires I am wondering if my wiring is a little different. There is a wire that comes out a few inches below where the coil pack is plugged in and it goes to ground. I am thinking this is probably the ground for the coil. Can anyone verify this? This ground wire in question has a little black box on the end of the wire just before the ring terminal. I'm not sure what this is. Does anyone happed to know which wire should be my ground wire going to my coil? The center wire is black/white and it gets 12volts when the ignition is switched on. The other two wires, one is white and the other is black. Does anyone have a wiring diagram?


Here is the coil plug





Here is the wire that I believe is the ground for the coil. I bolted it to the throttle body in this pic and then I realized that would probably not be a good test since the t/b is bolted to a plastic manifold.



Here is one of the ground on the transaxle. It tested good, but I guess that will not rule out and actual broken wire.



This is the other ground on top of the transaxle that also tested good.
 

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Im not good with electronics hun :( I'm just used to certain things going bad on my protege because of "this" or "that"

One time we couldn't get the engine to start cause my friend blew a fuse... and it was cause he left the battery plugged in while we were fucking with the wire harness. Im new to the mazda 6, so, I gave you all of what I could offer lol.
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
I changed out the crank and cam sensors...not change. Still no spark. The plugs do not smell like gas either so I assume they are not firing. I do have fuel pressure at the rail. One sensor that I did have to change out when I did the engine swap that is not really talked about is the one that bolts into the head next to the intake came closest to the timing cover. That plug got broken on the Fusion engine, so I swapped over the sensor from the mazda engine. They looked the same, but I thought I would throw it out there incase that is causing a problem.
Also, I checked the voltage at the coil while being cranked. When the key was switched on it showed about 12.5v (same as the battery). Then when cranking it drops down to about 10.5v. I am thinking this is not low enough for no spark, but again I thought I should throw it out.


**one other thing I thought of while I was looking though my pictures from the swap is that when I swapped the intake cams the bolt on the intake cam from the mazda engine came loose when I was loosening the crank shaft, so there for the cam gear turned with out the actual cam turning. So I am positive that the cam gear/sprocket is in a different orientation now than when I removed it from the mazda engine at TDC. I have no reason to believe the actual intake camshaft it's self is not a tdc, but if the actual intake gear/sprocket I am sure is not in the same position. I don't have a clue if this matters, because I don't know if there are tdc marks on the actual gear. Again, if this is a problem would it actually cause the engine not to spark?
 

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Discussion Starter #9
The car still is not starting. I re checked the timing today and it was off by a little bit so I locked everything back in place and loosened the crank bolt and re positioned the crank pulley to line up the hole in the pulley to the hole in the timing cover. I re-checked everything and it's now in time....but it still wont start, I am not getting spark and from smelling the spark plugs I don't think I am getting fuel either but the fuel pump is turning on. I am finally getting a CEL now after cranking for a little bit. I get code P0335 which is for the crank shaft position sensor, which make since because I know this will kill spark and I am pretty sure it sends the signal to turn on the fuel control ecm. I have replaced the sensor and no change. I tested the electrial connections for the senor with the key turned on and I am getting about .2 volts on one pin and about .5v on the other. I am not sure what the reading should be but I know on one of my nissans the sensors get a 5v signal. So I am thinking I may have a wiring issue in the Crank Sensor ciricut. I want to run new wires to the sensor but I am not sure where the terminate in the engine bay and I don't really want to cut all of my wire loom up. Does any one have a pin out/wiring diagram for the large connector that plugs in next to the engine bay fuse box? Thanks for any help.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
http://forum.mazda6club.com/mazda6-atenza/255038-wiring-diagram-mazda-atenza-2004-a.html


Some wiring diagrams were posted in this thread and I think they apply for my car. They are referring to one wire as G and the other L. The G makes sense because I have a green wire at the sensor, the other wire is light blue...is that what the L stands for? Also still not sure where these plug in at the plug in the engine bay next to the fuse box.
 

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Go here for free wiring diagrams. Sign up and look at anything you want. Not perfect but a start. I looked and looked at my Mitchel diagrams and did not see a "L" wire color.

Unfortunately, you've got yourself another non-expert here. However, it seems like you need to get back to basics and verify that you have the most basic signals of all, crank and cam (both ~5v signals I think.) Without them you've got pretty much nothing. The code you got means your headed in the right direction.

Below are the computer (PCM) pins that you need to monitor to see if you have signals present from the sensors (crank/cam) at the computer. You should be able to do this with a multimeter, as you crank the engine look for the voltage to change accordingly.

One other non-expert thing I'll throw out there. The large connector next to the fuse box is your computer (PCM) connector. If you disconnected the computer (PCM) connector at the computer and reconnected it you must verify that none of the pins are bent, damaged, or unseated since you put the connector back together. It only takes one to screw things up. Double check and also make sure the PCM is properly grounded to the chassis.

Go here for a copy of the service manual. The computer connector pin outs are in section 01-40A-14.

Don't know if I'll be much more help but I'll keep looking.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Thanks Chris! After looking around on google it seems that "L" is the code for Blue, or light blue. Which is good because my other wire coming off of the crank sensor is light blue. Once I get back to the car with the wiring diagrams I am going to probe the wires to check for continuity to make sure they are the correct wires then I will check the readings at the plug next to the fuse box and at the sensor to see if they match. If not I will run new wires rather than looking for a problem in the existing wires. I'll report back when I get back to the car again.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
okay, when I was testing the crank sensor connection before I did not have a good ground. Once I grounded my black lead to the valve cover I showed the same readings on the wires at the fuse box connection as the readings at the sensor plug. On the light blue wire I am showing ~2.03 volts with the key in the on position. The green wire shows ~2.5 volts with the key in the on position. I was not able to check the reading while the car was being cranked because I was by myself. Why am I getting a crankshaft sensor code? I have already swapped the sensor and I have tried the old one again, to rule the new sensor out since I saw the car run on the old sensor. Can anyone verify this is what their crank pulley and trigger wheel look like? This is a Fusion engine with Mazda 6 Stuff put back on it. This is the crank pulley that I marked as coming off of the Mazda engine. The trigger wheel does not go all the way under the crank sensor...not sure if it needs to. The crank pulley that came on the Fusion engine (I'm not using this pulley) appears to have a trigger wheel that extends further. Here is a picture of my mazda crank pulley installed. Can anyone verify this looks correct?


 

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I would suggest that you write to the guy at HappyWrenching. He is the expert on this swap and is extremely good at responding to questions. The blog is still active which is amazing in itself. The crank sensor is frequently mentioned in the blog so you might find an easy answer.

Let us know what ultimately solves the problem.
 

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An example of one exchange about a crank sensor ground:

"Do you have coil-over-plug ignition (4 coils...one on top of each spark plug) or single coil with spark plug wires?

If you have 4 individual coils, make sure that the coil ground connector is secure. It goes on the backside of the cyl. head on top of the transmission. Look for the picture in the guide right under step 9: "9. A few more things to remove here. " In that picture, the ground wire for the coils is held on with an 10-mm bolt that is shown roughly in between the red small letters "b" & "c". Without that ground the coils will not give spark.

As far as the leftover female plug in the front, it could be the knock sensor connector, it is on the intake side of the engine (left side) in between the power steering pump and intake manifold.

You really need to read my responses more CAREFULLY. I did not ask you to read step 9, I said that the picture you need is under step 9. The ground wire for the coil is denoted by the green arrow here:"
http://i1336.photobucket.com/albums/o656/nojodas67/mazda_6_shift_cable_removal_zpsbf768109.jpg

 

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Discussion Starter #16
An example of one exchange about a crank sensor ground:

"Do you have coil-over-plug ignition (4 coils...one on top of each spark plug) or single coil with spark plug wires?

If you have 4 individual coils, make sure that the coil ground connector is secure. It goes on the backside of the cyl. head on top of the transmission. Look for the picture in the guide right under step 9: "9. A few more things to remove here. " In that picture, the ground wire for the coils is held on with an 10-mm bolt that is shown roughly in between the red small letters "b" & "c". Without that ground the coils will not give spark.

As far as the leftover female plug in the front, it could be the knock sensor connector, it is on the intake side of the engine (left side) in between the power steering pump and intake manifold.

You really need to read my responses more CAREFULLY. I did not ask you to read step 9, I said that the picture you need is under step 9. The ground wire for the coil is denoted by the green arrow here:"
http://i1336.photobucket.com/albums/o656/nojodas67/mazda_6_shift_cable_removal_zpsbf768109.jpg
Thanks, I had already posted there too a while ago but I have not posted about having the crank sensor code. I'll do that now.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Does anyone know what the top two (closest to firewall) pins on the connector on the side of the engine bay fuse box are for? Mine look like there may be a problem. I am assuming this is not normal? Has anyone else unplugged this plug before? What is the best way to clean up the female side of the plug...contact cleaner?








and then this picture shows my cam lock in what I believe to be cylinder 1 tdc. Please feel free to let me know if you think this is wrong.


 

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"are your cam teeth the same number and position? I am pretty sure 06 had a different setup then 04. I went from 06 6i-11 fusion 2.5 mine were both the newer setup. "

My no start ended up being that trans ground..smh

dont go buying a crank sensor they're ~$90 and probably not the problem
 

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Discussion Starter #19
"are your cam teeth the same number and position? I am pretty sure 06 had a different setup then 04. I went from 06 6i-11 fusion 2.5 mine were both the newer setup. "

My no start ended up being that trans ground..smh

dont go buying a crank sensor they're ~$90 and probably not the problem
The intake cam I am using is from the 04 mazda engine, I swapped that in a long with all of the other recommended parts.


I am going to check the grounds again, I am also going to add another ground or two to the top of the trans to see if that helps anything.


I have already replaced both the cam and crank sensors just to rule them out...no change.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
hey guys, back at this again. I pulled the timing cover back off and re set the timing...I don't think it was off before but I did it just incase. My Dad was hooking the engine back up and a few things got messed up along the way. I need to know what this is so I can order another one. I posted a picture of it bolted to my throttle body (that is not where it goes) on page one of this thread. It goes close to the ignition coil.








It is gel filled and used to have one wire coming out of it. The only thing I can read on it it is 250/.047 Not getting much from google on this one.
 
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