[FSTASNTZ]

With all of this talk of larger turbos, 350+ whp and so on... what can the stock drivetrain handle? Is the clutch the weak link, and if so, after you upgrade it, what then becomes the weak link, the diff? Through the years of building motors and seeing drive trains break (Yoks on AWD DSMs, axles on Hondas, diffs in miatas) I wonder what the max capacity of the parts of the drivetrain are.
Anyone have any answers? Not just speculation here, but actual factual information. Testing, experience and so on...
Would be valuable to know what you would need to replace, if anything, when upping the torque and hp on the Speed6.


Thanks,
Jason

 

[strtfghtr]

I remember seeing a couple people on the msprotage.com boards that broke their rear diff mounts...I think that is the weak link for now. Too lazy to search for the post now though.

The clutch seems surprisingly resilliant

 

[Ferris]

My guess is you'll see the center diff be the first to go. Now 350 HP might not kill it if you size the turbo right and instead of upping the boost,ie more torque, but provide more boost past 5000RPM.

 

[strtfghtr]

My guess is you'll see the center diff be the first to go. Now 350 HP might not kill it if you size the turbo right and instead of upping the boost,ie more torque, but provide more boost past 5000RPM.
[/b]

Yeah the center diff would probably be a problem....





if the MS6 had one :slap:

 

[Ferris]

Yeah the center diff would probably be a problem....
if the MS6 had one :slap:
[/b]

pwned, humm not that I doubt you but how does the rears get power??

Sidenote I see you're in milford, I just moved up there. Any suggestions about the area?

 

[More cowbell]

the 2.3L engine is stout, i'd say 400whp easy with all the forged bits and piston oil jets, direct injection etc etc. Yeh that electromagnetic clutch/coupling would heat up quickly or not even hold that kinda power.

 

[strtfghtr]

pwned, humm not that I doubt you but how does the rears get power??

Sidenote I see you're in milford, I just moved up there. Any suggestions about the area?
[/b]

Here this should get you started:
http://forum.mazda6tech.com/viewforum.php?f=47

basicaly the long and short of it is that it has a haladex type coupling that activates a solenoid to engage a clutchpack which makes the connection from the constantly spinning center drive shaft to the rear diff.

Our cars can be 100% FWD if that clutch pack never engages

As for Milford I moved here in May but i have some great recomendations, PM me we should meet up and get a little speed6 talk or hit some of the bars...or better yet both

 

[Ferris]

:nana:

Here this should get you started:
http://forum.mazda6tech.com/viewforum.php?f=47

basicaly the long and short of it is that it has a haladex type coupling that activates a solenoid to engage a clutchpack which makes the connection from the constantly spinning center drive shaft to the rear diff.

Our cars can be 100% FWD if that clutch pack never engages

As for Milford I moved here in May but i have some great recomendations, PM me we should meet up and get a little speed6 talk or hit some of the bars...or better yet both
[/b]

Fine the COUPLER :nana:

I'll PM you.

 

[strtfghtr]

the 2.3L engine is stout, i'd say 400whp easy with all the forged bits and piston oil jets, direct injection etc etc. Yeh that electromagnetic clutch/coupling would heat up quickly or not even hold that kinda power.
[/b]

Yes and no on the clutch/coupling.

Depending on how it engages it shouldnt heat up very much...if it gently engages the clutchpack would definetly get hot, but the temp sensor in it would cut off the rear wheels before a lot of damage is done (or should anyway)

The solenoid/clutchpack is extreemly similar to the way an automatic tranny changes gears so if you've ever been in a race built automatic tranny the shifts are pretty harsh because the clutch packs are engaged much quicker than would normaly be...thus reducing heat

I'm not sure how "gradual" the engagement of our rear wheel is but it think it is rapid short pulses not long gradual ones. But I could be wrong

EDIT: speeling

 

[flyingm]

Well considering the fact that several people have complained about grinding gears even early on, I am going to assume that the transmission (and more specifically third gear) is going to be a problem with more power. For instance, I had to have my transmission replaced at 7k miles because third gear was completely toast. Under any type of deceleration it would pop out of gear.

 

[More cowbell]

Well considering the fact that several people have complained about grinding gears even early on, I am going to assume that the transmission (and more specifically third gear) is going to be a problem with more power. For instance, I had to have my transmission replaced at 7k miles because third gear was completely toast. Under any type of deceleration it would pop out of gear.
[/b]

i wouldn't say the tranny is weak. Its just one case. Even hondas have bad apples in a batch.

 

[strtfghtr]

I've ground 3rd my self once or twice...it just seems to need a little more clutch depression than the other gears, 4th and 5th go in so easily im not even sure if you need the clutch

 

[flyingm]

i wouldn't say the tranny is weak. Its just one case. Even hondas have bad apples in a batch[/b]

While it may be true that it isn't truly common, I would have to say that there is a pattern:

See second post

And here is one

And another

It seems to me at least that this isnt just an isolated issue.

 

[More cowbell]

this tranny is a brand new design, pretty beefy from what i read about it. Clutch sucks and i did grind first a few times but haven't done it in a while. If its grinding take it in for service, better it does it new then do it 50k later. So far i love this tranny minus the shitty on off switch clutch.
If you wanna see tranny failures, go to Nasioc. Now those are some shitty trannies.